PGY-1: First Month

So, as another July 1st has come and passed, neophyte first years have begun their training in pathology residency training programs across the country. Many will begin with either a bootcamp-style orientation and/or an introduction to surgical pathology. Although I do have a PGY-1 friend who started with a CP rotation (and not an intro one at that).

I was fortunate to have a creative surgpath director who has an interest in different styles of medical education during my PGY-1. During the last two weeks of June, in addition to the general administrative orientation requirements, we had what we affectionately refer to as our “bootcamp.” First, we were taught proper blade/cutting technique with various food products (eg – potatoes, bratwurst) to get a feel for how to adjust our cutting technique for various specimen consistencies.

She was truly dedicated and personally went to a butcher in Chicago and picked up pig organ blocks three times for us during those two weeks. Then she and one of our two surgical fellows instructed us in the Rokitansky en bloc method of autopsy dissection after we had watched a narrated DVD that she had created from the previous year PGY-1 training sessions. We then would have to complete a fourth unsupervised pig block dissection and need to score at least a 75% in order to pass our autopsy competency exam. Those who did not pass, had to repeat the exam.

We also learned how to cut mock uteri and prostates since these are common specimens. She had molded and frozen ground turkey to simulate these organs and even added surprises like chick peas to represent leiomyomas. We practiced how to bivalve and cut the uteri for both endometrial and cervical cancers as well as how to gross prostates…although I did go through the whole year and never get one until I rotated in the fall of my second year at the VA where I got them almost daily.

Additionally, in order to learn how to cut frozen sections, we took ten sections from various organs from our pig blocks and embedded, cut, and stained frozen sections. This way we could understand how certain sections cut better than others (eg – fatty tissue is more difficult to cut), how to orient them, and how to cut them well without folding and unevenness. We were then graded on our sections for frozen section competency exam. For those who did not pass, they got some personal remediation at the cryostat with our assistant director of surgical pathology.

In the gross room, we had PAs who were good at teaching. We practiced dictating biopsies and placentas, grossing placentas, and grossing “smalls” like an appendix or gallbladder. Twice a week, we had multi-scope subspecialty sessions in dermpath, liver, renal, and neuropath since most of these types of specimens go to either our fellows or the subspecialty pathologists and our first years rarely saw them.

We initially started with a six-person, six-day schedule of frozens, grossing biopsies/smalls/bigs preview, grossing bigs, autopsy, peds path, and neuropath for 1.5 months. Our PAs usually gross our biopsies and benign smaller specimens. Then we were whittled down to a four-person, four-day schedule of frozens, preview, bigs, and autopsy with two of us taking “mandatory” vacations. The two residents that remained on SP after our five months of intro to SP were incorporate into our standard three-person, three-day schedule of frozen/grossing bigs, biopsy/smalls signout/bigs preview, and bigs signout.

At my new program, it is different because we don’t have surgpath fellows. Since we are a small program, each senior resident serves as a co-chief and one of their responsibilities is the training of the PGY-1 residents in surgpath during an initial one-month intro to SP rotation. Other senior residents on the surgpath rotation also help out with the teaching. They also give AM lectures on grossing topics in Lester’s Manual of Surgical Pathology and the specific nuances of the grossing preferences of our attendings.

As for me, I start off with a comprehensive CP rotation that combines working in both the chemistry and microbiology sections. As a PGY-1 here, they have 2 months of ‘Wet Lab’ or an intro to CP rotation. But since I am a PGY-3 transfer, I am a cross between a PGY-1 in terms of knowing how things are exactly done here and a senior resident. So this month for me combines intro to SP, Wet Lab, and the subsequent comp CP rotation that would come after Wet Lab. So, I get to gross a little (since things may be done differently here), learn about where and how things are done in the labs, and study more specialized CP topics. Since I came from a program where we rotate at four different hospitals for surgpath and can be self-directed in terms of CP, this works fine for me but still can be initially daunting in terms of trying to fit in do things the way they would like them done here.

So what do you think are the best ways to train PGY-1 residents most effectively? Should they start off with an intro to SP rotation and how should that be structured in terms of time, topic areas, and teaching of those topic areas? Or does it matter if they don’t do an intro to SP rotation and go straight into a CP rotation? And who should teach them how to gross? Let us know how things are done at your institution.

 

Chung

-Betty Chung, DO, MPH, MA is a third year resident physician at Rutgers – Robert Wood Johnson University Hospital in New Brunswick, NJ.

General Versus Subspecialty Surgical Pathology Sign-Out

I’m currently on a month of neuropathology/autopsy at our main academic center. After 2 months at a busy surgpath site with a 1-1.5 hour drive each way, it’s finally nice to be able to take a breather. Here, I’m responsible for any neuro frozen and grossing that doesn’t go to the SP resident, helping with the cutting of autopsy brains, and sign-out of neuropath cases. Since we don’t have a heavy neurosurgery service, this allows me more time to learn at my own pace and I feel that I’m able to retain more.

Not including CP rotations, I’ve always learned more, retained knowledge, and performed better on the subspecialty rotations that I’ve had – hematopathology, pediatric pathology, and now neuropathology. While I acknowledge that part of this is my own fault because when I’m on surgical pathology (we do general SP sign-outs), I read up pretty much only on my cases. I know that I need to preview them for sign-out so I read up on the SP diagnoses and differentials. But I often am not motivated to read up on general systems, so I can be real hot mess (and as one senior resident called me recently, “stupid”) during unknown conferences. In CP topics and those subspecialty areas I’ve had rotations in, I’m quite the opposite and tend to excel.

Yesterday, was the first time I’ve been at consensus conference since my first year. At the community and VA hospitals where I’ve spent most of my SP rotations during my second year, we didn’t have group consensus conferences. I remember last year thinking during consensus, “please don’t pick on me to answer a question” during the inevitable pimp sessions that evolved. But yesterday, besides the fellow, I was the only senior resident present. But I was less apprehensive and intimidated than I had been when I sat in the same place the year before. So even though I don’t consider myself a person who is good at SP, I was adequate enough and I must have learned something over the past year without realizing it.

Obviously, how we teach surgical pathology is restricted by the type of sign-out practiced at the institution we are at and this often is dictated by specimen volumes, faculty expertise, and the cultural philosophy dominant there. Even though I thought that I had taken this question into consideration when interviewing and ranking programs, I realize now that I didn’t have a complete grasp on how training styles and cultures really would affect me. Probably since I’m graduate school trained first and naturally think more like a scientist that focuses on one area and learning everything about that area, subspecialty sign-out works best for me.

Before starting residency, I had an intuition that this was true but thought that I would eventually adapt to a general sign-out format since that is how my institution practices. And I’ve adjusted, albeit maybe not progressed as quickly as my peers. It’s difficult to maintain all surgical pathology as subspecialty unless the volume is high enough and this usually means a large, well-known academic center if that’s what you need during your training. The majority of residents will end up in private practice and many often train at places where the sign-out is a more generalized one. So how do we match our learning needs with practice requirements at our training institutions with our eventual responsibilities as a pathologist in terms of sign-out? I can’t say that I have a solution for this conundrum but would welcome opinions on the topic. What works best to train our residents in surgical pathology?

 

Chung

Betty Chung, DO, MPH, MA is a second year resident physician at the University of Illinois Hospital and Health Sciences System in Chicago, IL.

The End of the Rotation

Since my program is on a monthly rotation schedule, last Thursday was the last day of my 2-month surgpath rotation at our busiest site, which is private practice at a community hospital that serves a more middle class and affluent patient population than our main academic hospital. So, it seems appropriate to finish my “Adventures in Grossing, Part I” post from 2 weeks ago now. As I think I mentioned in that previous post, my first day at this site (right after I just had gotten back from almost 10 hours of traveling due to layovers coming back from USCAP and getting a migraine during my flight to boot), was a disaster to say the very least.

I had made the mistake of jokingly saying to my rotation director that I was the most CP oriented of those in my year (I’m the last 2nd year to rotate at this site this year)…and he had mistakenly heard my statement as “I dislike surgpath and because of that probably wouldn’t work hard at this rotation.” We were reminiscing about it today as we had our face-to-face end of the rotation evaluation about how much has changed since that first day.

Communication is very important and sometimes that also entails knowing what not to say in a situation, especially if it can be misinterpreted. Luckily for me, after I had another talk with my rotation director, he was willing to ‘start fresh’ and see whether his initial impression of me held true. We did not work together again until the end of the month as I was assigned to other attendings during the interim. But by the time, we were assigned together again, he was “happy” with what he had heard about me from the other attendings.

As a first year, I had heard rumors about how hard this site and some of the attendings were…the stuff of legend so to speak. First years do not rotate at this site as we need to build up our grossing and time management skills to be able to adequately manage the higher volume of grossing at this site. We have a three-day schedule that includes two days allotted to finish grossing and a third intra-operative consultation day which includes frozen sections, sentinel node touch preps, and intra-op gross examination of specimens.

I still need to work on my grossing speed and time management skills but after two months of instruction and experience at this site, I do recognize that I have improved. It’s almost the end of my second year and I generally do fine with diagnoses at sign-out because they are either things I’ve seen before or things that I have some time to read about prior to sign-out. But when it comes to unknown conferences or my RISE surgical pathology scores for the past two years, I know that I am horribly deficient and need some work.

In two months, I will be transferring to a much smaller program in my home state for personal family reasons. My medical school friend will be one of the chiefs next year and one of their incoming first years is also from my medical school. Plus, they rotate mainly at one site and do 1-2 rotations/year at another site that is near where my parents live and where I went to medical school. So it will be different than my current program which has 27 residents that rotate at four sites. The culture also seems very different and I worry that I may be behind the curve in terms of my surgical pathology (SP) knowledge. I’m not worried about CP as my strengths and background are in CP.

So, I’ve been wondering…what are some good resources to learn SP and some good approaches to learn while busy on rotations? I still haven’t found a good solution to these questions yet.

 

Chung

Betty Chung, DO, MPH, MA is a second year resident physician at the University of Illinois Hospital and Health Sciences System in Chicago, IL.