I recently returned from sunny San Diego where I attended the CAP Residents Forum and USCAP. While at USCAP, I met more than my fair share of pathologists from Canada. After all, the “C” in USCAP stands for Canadian. I was surprised to learn that pathology residency there is 5 years–they still have a clinical “intern-like” year–and their residencies are either AP only or CP (referred to as “general pathology”) only programs.
In the US, most pathology subspecialties belong to one group or the other. The one exception is hematopathology which bridges AP and CP;in some programs is considered as AP and in others as CP. So I asked how they consider hematopathology in Canada. Most of those whom I met were AP trained and told me that in terms of hemepath, they only look at bone marrows (“tissue”). The peripherals and aspirates (“liquids”) are read by hem/onc and not likely to be relinquished to pathology as it is a good source of revenue for them.
When I told them that I was trained to read peripheral blood smears, aspirates, clots, and bone marrows, they told me that was because I was “CP trained” in terms of hemepath. They also told me that when they study hemepath in Canada, (I’m not sure if I misunderstood this part) that they aren’t really trained to diagnose lymphomas well. So they prefer to go to the US to train in hemepath fellowships to get the exposure and tend to hire US-trained hematopathologists. But I was also told that Canadian residencies are transforming and now beginning to incorporate more training in lymphoma diagnosis.
So, this brings me to some thoughts on AP and CP training. I was re-reading my most recent posts and realized that some recent frustrations I’ve experienced on my surgpath rotations accentuated my natural proclivities and bias. So, first, I’d like to say that I do not dislike surgpath. But I do think that the culture and some personalities in surgpath don’t really mesh well with a research-trained physician-scientist me. I often get the comment that I am “too academic” or I’m “more like a scientist than a pathologist” (which I didn’t think was a bad thing for a CP-oriented resident).We all have our biases and there is nothing wrong with that. But I often notice that the needs of the AP portions of our programs sometimes dominate over CP.
At multiple programs I rotated through during medical school and in my current program, if there is no autopsy resident that month, residents on CP rotations are assigned autopsy duty during the week while the surgpath residents cover the weekends and holidays. AP inclined residents and attendings often try to convince me that I never know if I’ll end up practicing surgpath. Even though residents often take vacations during CP rotations or spend most of their time studying for boards and not 100% actively engaging in their CP rotations, most of the time, CP attendings just expect this sort of attitude towards CP.
And so this tension between the two pathologies sometimes befuddles me. A co-resident even asked me if I’d consider doing a little surgpath with hemepath like the general pathologists at our community hospitals do(my answer is “probably not”)or I’ve gotten the “what are you going to do with molecular training?” question as well. This is not because there is anything wrong with surgpath (I know I might rant when I’m frustrated but I think knowing surgpath can only help me with my future career choices). But I wonder why when a first year resident comes in saying they want to do dermpath, they get hooked up to do derm/dermpath research (it’s important to match for dermpath fellowships) and I have people trying to convince me that I should want to do surgpath. Why does it seem harder to accept when a resident says that they want to do a CP subspecialty (maybe with the exception of hemepath)? Have you had experiences where a tension between the AP and CP sides of pathology reared its ugly head?Why do you think this may be so?
–Betty Chung, DO, MPH, MA is a second year resident physician at the University of Illinois Hospital and Health Sciences System in Chicago, IL.